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	<title>Comments on: Demolicracy</title>
	<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150</link>
	<description>The blog and website of Lance Webel.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 09:22:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: keg34</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-22715</link>
		<author>keg34</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 23:47:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-22715</guid>
		<description>I'm kind of fond of an idea that I heard Tom Brokaw promoting at a conference a few months ago.  He suggested that we take a 3-day weekend to allow the whole country to go to electronic voting kiosks, which would be in malls, libraries, and virtually any public place, enter the pin numbers from their electronic ID's, and cast their ballots.  We make it a national holiday weekend.  All votes are calculated electronically--no exit polling, no reliable fodder for the pundits, no East Coast results being broadcast early and skewing the decisions of West Coast voters.  Everyone finds out the results together on Monday morning and we get a new president.  Too simple, perhaps, but I like it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m kind of fond of an idea that I heard Tom Brokaw promoting at a conference a few months ago.  He suggested that we take a 3-day weekend to allow the whole country to go to electronic voting kiosks, which would be in malls, libraries, and virtually any public place, enter the pin numbers from their electronic ID&#8217;s, and cast their ballots.  We make it a national holiday weekend.  All votes are calculated electronically&#8211;no exit polling, no reliable fodder for the pundits, no East Coast results being broadcast early and skewing the decisions of West Coast voters.  Everyone finds out the results together on Monday morning and we get a new president.  Too simple, perhaps, but I like it.</p>
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		<title>By: David Y?</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21964</link>
		<author>David Y?</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:22:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21964</guid>
		<description>I guess saying "well why don't we just change it so it works better" isn't going to work here...
but shouldn't it be that simple? shouldn't our government be able to change for the people whom it (claims to) serve? I mean, if someone set it up, can't we do something about it, or at least be able to do something about it in a relatively short amount of time? what if...
the funny thing about those kinds of questions is that they get answered, but nothing ever happens.
oh well.
i'll die and go to heaven.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess saying &#8220;well why don&#8217;t we just change it so it works better&#8221; isn&#8217;t going to work here&#8230;<br />
but shouldn&#8217;t it be that simple? shouldn&#8217;t our government be able to change for the people whom it (claims to) serve? I mean, if someone set it up, can&#8217;t we do something about it, or at least be able to do something about it in a relatively short amount of time? what if&#8230;<br />
the funny thing about those kinds of questions is that they get answered, but nothing ever happens.<br />
oh well.<br />
i&#8217;ll die and go to heaven.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21588</link>
		<author>Steve</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Sep 2007 07:52:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21588</guid>
		<description>Is requiring photo ID really a "unconstitutional burden" for people?

If we are talking about online voting and that sort of thing, the procedure for that goes WAY beyond the 'burden' of getting an ID card from the local dmv.  If the lowest common denominator on this is 'having ID', we'll never get online voting.

Is there any doubt this is more a 'political' discussion than it is a 'practical' one?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is requiring photo ID really a &#8220;unconstitutional burden&#8221; for people?</p>
<p>If we are talking about online voting and that sort of thing, the procedure for that goes WAY beyond the &#8216;burden&#8217; of getting an ID card from the local dmv.  If the lowest common denominator on this is &#8216;having ID&#8217;, we&#8217;ll never get online voting.</p>
<p>Is there any doubt this is more a &#8216;political&#8217; discussion than it is a &#8216;practical&#8217; one?</p>
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		<title>By: Lance</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21585</link>
		<author>Lance</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Sep 2007 02:41:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21585</guid>
		<description>Oh, it's getting painful to read &lt;a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/26/washington/26scotus.html?_r=1&#038;oref=slogin" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"&gt;news stories like this&lt;/a&gt;.

Citizen's ID, anyone? :???:</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, it&#8217;s getting painful to read <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/26/washington/26scotus.html?_r=1&#038;oref=slogin" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">news stories like this</a>.</p>
<p>Citizen&#8217;s ID, anyone? <img src='http://webel.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif' alt=':???:' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: mattmc3</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21582</link>
		<author>mattmc3</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 01:16:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21582</guid>
		<description>Lance - I'm amazed that you left out what I percieve to be the single biggest problem with our voting system - the electoral college.

Our forefathers said they didn't want a two party system, but the way they designed the electoral college *favors* a two party system.  If no candidates receive 270 out of 538 electoral votes, then congress choses the next president - regardless of the number of popular votes.  So, unless the field is narrowed down to only two candidates, American voters will not be guaranteed their votes even count towards choosing the president.  Of course, 4 of our 43 presidents (J.Q. Adams, Hayes, Harrison, and Bush) actually LOST the popular election, but won due to the electoral college so the 2-party system still doesn't guarantee a democratic election.

With our 2 party system, you rarely find a candidate that aligns entirely with your views.  How many democrats are pro-life?  How many republicans are environmentally friendly?  How many democrats admit that religious and privatized social programs are way more effective than wasting tax dollars on the equivalent government sponsored programs?  How many republicans would lobby for a &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_taxation" rel="nofollow"&gt;progressive tax&lt;/a&gt;?  It's not likely in a 2-party system you'd ever find someone who aligns with your views unless you are a cookie-cutter conservative or liberal.  So, middle America is just as likely to vote against a candidate than vote for one.  Or, just not vote.  Why cast an affirmative vote for someone you wouldn't want to affirm?

If I had my pick, I'd go for one of the ranking systems: &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Range_voting" rel="nofollow"&gt;Range Voting&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instant-runoff_voting" rel="nofollow"&gt;Instant Runoff Voting&lt;/a&gt;, or &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preferential_voting" rel="nofollow"&gt;Preferential Voting&lt;/a&gt;.  Australia is there already.  Of course, this won't ever happen b/c the change requires people other than the typical republican or democrat to sit in the chairs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lance - I&#8217;m amazed that you left out what I percieve to be the single biggest problem with our voting system - the electoral college.</p>
<p>Our forefathers said they didn&#8217;t want a two party system, but the way they designed the electoral college *favors* a two party system.  If no candidates receive 270 out of 538 electoral votes, then congress choses the next president - regardless of the number of popular votes.  So, unless the field is narrowed down to only two candidates, American voters will not be guaranteed their votes even count towards choosing the president.  Of course, 4 of our 43 presidents (J.Q. Adams, Hayes, Harrison, and Bush) actually LOST the popular election, but won due to the electoral college so the 2-party system still doesn&#8217;t guarantee a democratic election.</p>
<p>With our 2 party system, you rarely find a candidate that aligns entirely with your views.  How many democrats are pro-life?  How many republicans are environmentally friendly?  How many democrats admit that religious and privatized social programs are way more effective than wasting tax dollars on the equivalent government sponsored programs?  How many republicans would lobby for a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_taxation" rel="nofollow">progressive tax</a>?  It&#8217;s not likely in a 2-party system you&#8217;d ever find someone who aligns with your views unless you are a cookie-cutter conservative or liberal.  So, middle America is just as likely to vote against a candidate than vote for one.  Or, just not vote.  Why cast an affirmative vote for someone you wouldn&#8217;t want to affirm?</p>
<p>If I had my pick, I&#8217;d go for one of the ranking systems: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Range_voting" rel="nofollow">Range Voting</a>, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instant-runoff_voting" rel="nofollow">Instant Runoff Voting</a>, or <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preferential_voting" rel="nofollow">Preferential Voting</a>.  Australia is there already.  Of course, this won&#8217;t ever happen b/c the change requires people other than the typical republican or democrat to sit in the chairs.</p>
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		<title>By: HP</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21578</link>
		<author>HP</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 23:16:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21578</guid>
		<description>Yeah, but if Mr. Johnson keeps performing like that on Sundays, I may have to create a Hanging Chad of my own...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, but if Mr. Johnson keeps performing like that on Sundays, I may have to create a Hanging Chad of my own&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Annie</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21577</link>
		<author>Annie</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 21:49:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21577</guid>
		<description>I agree that the government wants to control our votes - Last year when they passed the law requiring  photo IDs, our church set up a program to help homeless people get IDs...but it's still a major problem -- Many people are shut out from voting...

I don't support political apathy, but I don't really blame people for feeling like it doesn't make a difference, especially when the electoral college, whoever they are, actually makes the decision. That's how a president can win the popular vote but still not be voted into the office. You know who I'm talking about. I'm not saying that Al Gore would have been a great choice either -- I'd just like to feel like my vote matters. Clearly with the current system, it doesn't, and I'm sure that the government wants to keep it that way.

At least they have moved to all computer voting! No more papers and punching holes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that the government wants to control our votes - Last year when they passed the law requiring  photo IDs, our church set up a program to help homeless people get IDs&#8230;but it&#8217;s still a major problem &#8212; Many people are shut out from voting&#8230;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t support political apathy, but I don&#8217;t really blame people for feeling like it doesn&#8217;t make a difference, especially when the electoral college, whoever they are, actually makes the decision. That&#8217;s how a president can win the popular vote but still not be voted into the office. You know who I&#8217;m talking about. I&#8217;m not saying that Al Gore would have been a great choice either &#8212; I&#8217;d just like to feel like my vote matters. Clearly with the current system, it doesn&#8217;t, and I&#8217;m sure that the government wants to keep it that way.</p>
<p>At least they have moved to all computer voting! No more papers and punching holes.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21576</link>
		<author>Steve</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 12:30:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21576</guid>
		<description>On the issue of online voting - if it's safe for me to do ALL of my banking online, why can't we come up with a safe, reliable way of doing online voting?

Are people's fears, and rants, about the safety of online voting founded in something or is it an opinion from ignorance and fear?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the issue of online voting - if it&#8217;s safe for me to do ALL of my banking online, why can&#8217;t we come up with a safe, reliable way of doing online voting?</p>
<p>Are people&#8217;s fears, and rants, about the safety of online voting founded in something or is it an opinion from ignorance and fear?</p>
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		<title>By: Lance</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21575</link>
		<author>Lance</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 12:05:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21575</guid>
		<description>I was not comparing America to other countries ... that's a whole different issue.  I was simply using a dramatic introduction about policy priorities to draw our attention on what I feel is a pretty huge domestic problem that I've &lt;i&gt;never&lt;/i&gt; heard discussed.

In my opinion, one of the great things about America is that things like this &lt;i&gt;can&lt;/i&gt; be changed instead of ignored ... and I believe that pointing out the problems and voicing my opinions are two of the most patriotic things I can do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was not comparing America to other countries &#8230; that&#8217;s a whole different issue.  I was simply using a dramatic introduction about policy priorities to draw our attention on what I feel is a pretty huge domestic problem that I&#8217;ve <i>never</i> heard discussed.</p>
<p>In my opinion, one of the great things about America is that things like this <i>can</i> be changed instead of ignored &#8230; and I believe that pointing out the problems and voicing my opinions are two of the most patriotic things I can do.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21574</link>
		<author>Steve</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 06:37:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://webel.net/archives/1150#comment-21574</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I don’t understand why America is so interested in promoting “democracy” in foreign countries, especially those on the other side of the globe,...&lt;/blockquote&gt; 

Because it's better than dictatorships where the dictator murders it's citizens at his whim.

&lt;blockquote&gt;...when our form of democracy is so incredibly ineffective and stagnant.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Not sure who you've been reading, but this is a VERY pessimistic way of looking at America.  

For me, after 7 years of living in a one party, communist system - I love the American system more than ever (flaws and all).  With all of it's faults, at least none of my friends have been murdered by the local officials because of their faith in Jesus Christ!  

Freedom is so valuable to me, I'm willing to jump through the 'hoops of democracy' to vote.  Maybe I'm silly or naive, but I still believe my vote counts...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I don’t understand why America is so interested in promoting “democracy” in foreign countries, especially those on the other side of the globe,&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p>Because it&#8217;s better than dictatorships where the dictator murders it&#8217;s citizens at his whim.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8230;when our form of democracy is so incredibly ineffective and stagnant.</p></blockquote>
<p>Not sure who you&#8217;ve been reading, but this is a VERY pessimistic way of looking at America.  </p>
<p>For me, after 7 years of living in a one party, communist system - I love the American system more than ever (flaws and all).  With all of it&#8217;s faults, at least none of my friends have been murdered by the local officials because of their faith in Jesus Christ!  </p>
<p>Freedom is so valuable to me, I&#8217;m willing to jump through the &#8216;hoops of democracy&#8217; to vote.  Maybe I&#8217;m silly or naive, but I still believe my vote counts&#8230;</p>
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