Comments on: 03 :: The Death of the Three R’s

By: Mike

Mike — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 14:35:19 +0000

I really like your suggested topics that should be taught in school. I’ve often argued/suggested that personal finance and basic life skills need to be addressed at school in some way… mainly because it’s not taught at home often enough.

By: Annie

Annie — Sun, 04 May 2008 19:39:35 +0000

If you look at the way our educational system in America is heading, I don’t think we really are a society that values creativity or collaboration. I’m a high school English teacher who teaches 10th graders, and part of my job is to get students ready for the Ohio Graduation Test - a standardized test that focuses mostly on getting students to produce written responses that are the same as everyone else’s with all of the requirements of a “good” writing piece. Don’t get me wrong — I believe that every student should know how to write an organized piece of writing with strong grammar and conventions, but I think there are plenty of of creative ways to teach students how to do that without sucking the life out of them with testing…But until the government stops tying public school funding into our test scores, my hands are somewhat tied as a teacher.

Dissecting literature isn’t about future use of similes and discovery of symbolism in every day life; it teaches thinking skills and problem solving skills. It teaches students how to look deeper into something and think about things that are below the surface. I would even argue that it teaches students to evaluate their own beliefs and opinions instead of brainlessly accepting everything that they’ve been taught by others. I want my students to question me and disagree with me. Mostly, I just want them to be able to think on their own.

By: HP

HP — Sun, 04 May 2008 17:00:51 +0000

Exactly MattMc3… I thought Calculus was POINTLESS in high school. Then I went to college for engineering and realized it is at the fundamental heart of SO many everyday things around us. The problem with the way most teachers teach these subjects is they don’t RELATE them to everyday life. I would LOVE to be a high school teacher of math or science so I could teach the theory AND the application, having spent a good number of years as an engineer and businessman. But alas I cannot because the STATE says that my practical experience and (IMHO) WAY higher level of education in those subjects than ANY high school math or science teacher gets is not sufficient to “CERTIFY” me to be a teacher. I would need to go back to college and take exciting classes about how to put together a pretty classroom bulletin board and how to average grades in a grade book to be able to join their UNIONIZED CLAN. So they PURPOSELY EXCLUDE people like me with practical knowledge and desire from teaching kids. Yet another thing that is wrong with “the system.”

By: MattMc3

MattMc3 — Sun, 04 May 2008 15:59:11 +0000

As an addition to BethanyL’s comment - God chose to reveal himself to use via the written word - there is great value in knowing how to read critically, see patterns, understand symbolism, metaphor, and foreshadowing.

As for Math - how would I ever cut a piece of wood correctly, or know how to square my garden’s corners without knowing geometry? How would I balance my checkbook or forecast my budget without algebra (a - b + c - x = total… I’m missing charge x!)? The problem isn’t Math and Lit - it’s needing to remind kids of the practical life applications.

By: BethanyL

BethanyL — Sun, 04 May 2008 03:39:19 +0000

I dissect literature with several of my friends. The ability to critically read something, not just mindlessly absorb the words on the page greatly enhances my ability to learn skills at my job and make in the moment decisions when necessary. The skills I learned from lit teachers have made shifting from exclusive lit/casual reading for pleasure to reading books that will help develop leadership skills much simpler.
Then again, I was the kid that wrote book reports over summer break just for fun.
Math, I still don’t get, especially with the advent of technology to fall back on. Math and I are mortal enemies.

By: HP

HP — Sun, 04 May 2008 03:37:44 +0000

Without math and science, we will no longer HAVE an information age. If not for the math and science wizards, who do you think would develop all these nifty “information age” devices we all get to enjoy? Somebody with perfect Social networking Consumerism Netizenship skills, who is a good Environmental steward (ie, “tree hugger”) of the highest order??? I know Al Gore thinks he invented the internet, but come ON! I guarantee you it wasn’t him or anybody like him who invented the new Blackberry I got this week…

That being said, I do see a place for teaching some of these topics to kids, but not at the expense of eliminating the basics. For instance, its hilarious (actually, its sad) that our kids teachers ask them to type up reports when they don’t know the first thing about ASDF or QWERTY. I asked Jakob’s teacher at a conference why they aren’t teaching them keyboarding in 4th grade, given the internet age they are growing up in, and she looked at me like I had 3 heads. Excuse me, but if you aren’t going to teach them to type, then don’t require a multiple page report to be typewritten unless you want to come to my house and put up with the crying about how long it is taking to find the “F” key or the “M” key on our keyboard. Needless to say, some of these topics will need to be supplemented by parents in this test-happy society. One of my goals for Jakob this summer will be to learn how to type. I’m hoping to find some cool websites that will help me in this regard and make it fun for him, etc. Hopefully one of those people who were taught math or science in high school at the expense of “tree hugger-ism” are still around programming something like that for him to use.

As for some of the other topics, parents should be teaching them to children on a day in and day out basis. I know I really stress all the aspects of personal finance with our kids every chance that I get.

Most importantly, parents need to follow the instructions given by God regarding the “education” of their children:

Deuteronomy 11:18-19: Fix these words of mine in your hearts and minds; tie them as symbols on your hands and bind them on your foreheads. Teach them to your children, talking about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up.

Proverbs 22:6: Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it.

By: MattMc3

MattMc3 — Sat, 03 May 2008 17:47:42 +0000

I find it difficult to want to argue against change in the school system - I was bored to tears until High School, and even then was never challenged enough to crack open a book and actually study. And my straight “A” grades rewarded my apathy - that is, until college at Miami where attending the class wasn’t sufficient to learn the material, let alone pass the class. However, by that time, having been exposed to a wide variety of subjects to study, I found my niche and loved my major enough that it was worth the effort.

What needs to change in the schools, in my not-so-humble opinion, is that we need to quit testing so often and teaching to the test, we need to do a better job of challenging really bright kids so they aren’t disenfranchised with the process, we need to identify the stragglers so that they can receive help earlier, and we need to intervene with the trouble makers and remove them from inhibiting the process for others because education is treated too much like a right and not enough like a privilege.

I agree with you Lance about finance - kids really need to learn that debt is bondage, that compound interest will cause you to pay over $400K for a $100K house given 30 years at 5%, and that if you don’t pay yourself first, you’ll never save a dime. But, I have to disagree with you about Math and Language Arts - these are subjects that teach you how to think, how to problem solve, and are the quintessential left-brain and right-brain exercises that all other subjects build upon. Trying too hard to tailor all curriculum to the latest societal fad will leave us in worse shape than we are today.

As a parent of a 4 and 2 year old, all these tiny kiddos are bundles of potential for 1000’s of different careers, jobs, hobbies, and passions - and the job of an educator IMHO is to gently expose kids to a wide range of possibilities and provide opportunities for these kids to find their futures. And the job of parents is to everything in their power to *not* merely farm off the education of their children to some teacher, but to actively participate in the growth and education of their children.

By: Ben

Ben — Sat, 03 May 2008 11:45:30 +0000

I’m a long time lurker, first time poster. I’m willing to stand up for Math and Science in this context. I’m a recent Computer Engineering graduate, about to begin my career, and I can unequivically say that subjects like basic algebra, calculus, and physics directly apply to my every day life.

While I’ll agree that most people in non-engineering careers may not use mathematics very often, lessening it’s presence in school curriculum would be a terrible mistake moving forward. Predominantly the jobs that are leaving the country are manufacturing and trade jobs, and while some engineering is also moving oversees, it’s doing so primarily because the American educational system isn’t producing enough qualified students to meet the demand. If anything, I think that math and science curriculum’s should be overhauled and stressed even more in the future. But I also realize that my perspective is very skewed.

By: David Y?

David Y? — Sat, 03 May 2008 05:18:19 +0000

Are schools appropriate at all? Should we have specialized education for children, judging them from birth to be a certain person, set in a certain career, with a specific education put in place for them?
I agree. The system is flawed. But I think it could be solved if kids had more time with there parents in their jobs, with their parents not only teaching them the trade, but how to live life as a good, moral and upstanding person.
However, that is preluded by the fact that the parents would have to be…good moral and upstanding. Because the best teacher isn’t in a classroom. It’s at home.
I’m also not sure we are teaching what we taught for centuries. Yes, the system needs a massive overhall to deal with this century, but on the other hand…when did this concept of every child in a class come to mind? I was under the impression that children didn’t go to school until recently, unless particularly bright.
Would it be better if the basis for an education wasn’t simply English or Math, but whatever was a vessel for teaching children how to problem solve, or something that is applicable to everything?
With that said, yes, I haven’t used Math or English in the context the taught them, however, the skills that were ground into me using Math and English, I do use. Such as problem solving, Studying, group dynamics, sharing, blah blah blah…I’ve yet to map nouns again.
I do think that our society is WASTING AWAY, because of the lack of integration between so called Home Life, and School. A child doesn’t just shut of his brain because he walks out of a building.
As too why we focus on Math and English, I think its the same reason we still have our travel infrastructure.